"Clothing" Items: Interesting But Often Unfamiliar

Dear folks -

Clothing items are among the textiles that we see less in the market. I suppose the wearers had/have difficulty seeing them in either the ethnographic or aesthetic terms that we often do.

Some items, though, are dramatic and the felt shepherd's cloaks are one of those, especially if they are decorated.

Here is another example from our archives.



I think it is there because Michael Wendorf vowed once to go on a hunt to find one like it.

But many clothing items can be obscure. The Anatolian sash I bought last Spring in Turkey often puzzles very experienced folks who simply have not encountered anything like it.

http://www.ihbs.org/events/09092007/326.JPG

And I ran into an Armenian apron during a summer sojourn a year ago without recognizing it.

http://turkotek.com/misc_00052/armenian_apron.htm

Saul has often included items of clothing in his TM presentations. Here is part of one in which he presented an apron that triggered me to post from a book on traditional Bulgarian costumes that I have.

http://www.turkotek.com/misc_00003/discussion1.html

Probably "costume," from the rug-producing areas, has been more closely studied than I think, but it often seems an area from which obscure-seeming items can emerge.

A useful exhibition.

Regards,

R. John Howe

Prideful workwomanship!

G'day Steve and all,

Thanks Steve, for giving us a beautiful glimpse of a colourful and intricate past. Just seeing these wonderful handmade items uplifts but perhaps also leaves something akin to loss when one considers how unlikely that the people who create/d these things will devote the time and skill necessary to produce them for very much longer.

In the past when the tribes produced their own fabrics from their own animals, possibly dying them with colours from their own fields, there may have been competition between districts/weavers vying for the recognition their particular skill may bring in creating their particular villages identifiable apparel, or even more elaborate personal items for their own family.

Today, when even the least well off can view/purchase splendid readymade items in local markets, offered at fairly inexpensive prices, this might have an impact on the production of labour intensive homemade items. Although we are now in the 21st century and many of the peoples who made these things in the past have generally left strugglestreet a little behind them, life for them can be still be relatively hard, and the effort involved in making such things these days may not be quite so justified as in the past.

We in the Western world tend toward fairly drab accoutrements, especially the males, so different to the avian species which reflect quite the opposite, however the places from whence the items shown in Sauls exhibition came/come from allow both sexes of the species human to display in vivid glorious colour.

I think we should look at the things shown to us here with respect and a little sadness, in recognition of them being products of something pre industrial and which we may be unlikely to see much production of in the future.

Regards,
Marty.

Hi Marty

I agree with all you say, and those are the reasons Saul collects clothing.

Regards

Steve Price

Tulu Gloves

Steve,

Those blue tulu gloves are for washing the family camel. Dip them in Orvus, scrub, rinse, repeat.

Patrick Weiler

Hi People

Although the notion of collecting clothing may seem a little out of the mainstream, I think it's worth mentioning that such items have been "collectible" by ruggies for some time.

We've had a couple of Salons on textiles from mainland SE Asia, nearly all of which are garments. Turkmen chyrpy, Uzbek chapan, have been discussed here from time to time.

And if it isn't too much of a stretch, animal trappings serve much the same functions when put on animals as articles of clothing do when put on people. In fact, I've presented two Saturday morning talks at the Textile Museum along these lines, more than 10 years ago. One was entitled, Turkoman embroidered trappings for people and other large animals, another, Old clothes from Africa and Asia.

I don't know of many people besides Saul whose collections include socks or gloves, though.

Regards

Steve Price

If its woven by hand

G'day all,

Personally, I find it difficult to walk past something interesting which is handwoven, nicely coloured and within budget, regardless its purpose.

Knitted socks might be a bit of a stretch, although I have a couple of pairs which my mother knitted many years ago which I keep for love and respect

Some years ago I came across a beautiful heavy silk jacket in a muted red which a more knowledable mate suggested was handwoven 'watered' (whatever THAT means) silk. It was a truely wellmade piece and one which I liked wearing myself except it was identified as a womans jacket, and to make it especially special to those in the know, had a ragged label on which was the word Balenciaga...a name which meant absolutely nothing to me.

The jacket was very nice, I bought it and eventually gave it to my godmother when I grew tired of friends asking why I was wearing 'that ladies pink jacket'!

Regards,
Marty.

Hi all,

As dedicated Turkotekkers know, I also have some interest in ethnic clothing and have managed to find some pieces that we like from tribal groups in S. China. I think that all of them are functional, but I must say that I have spent much less time researching those textiles than I have for rugs.

Last year I ran across a very interesting embroidered felt coat in a flea market in Sichuan province of China. I had a hard time understanding the seller, but I gather that it was used by shepherds in nomadic groups in the Tibetan plateau. The fellow had a picture taken from some Chinese book with an old picture of a shepherd wearing the item. The design was crude, bold and dramatic (mostly red and blue on white). I can't remember much more than that because I decided I couldn't think of anything to do with it, and certainly couldn't explain why I bought it to my wife. I think I still regret the decision. Maybe next time...

James.

Hi James

The pieces we passed up always get better in memory. It reminds me of an incident at one of the ACOR dealer fairs some years back. I found a beautiful, mint Yomud uuk-bash, and put it down long enough to haggle the price with the dealer. While I was doing that, another collector picked it up, read the price tag, and bought it.

I ran into him later, and he apologized for taking it out from under my nose, but hoped I'd understand. I told him that I actually got the better of it. He now owned it, and would find every flaw in it sooner or later. I, on the other hand, had only my memory, and it would get better every year in my mind. Interestingly, he contacted me a year or two later and wanted to sell it to me at a substantial profit. I declined.

Regards

Steve Price

The Road Less Travelled

Greetings all,

As one of the Turkotekistanis who gladly confesses to the purchase of nicely worked handmade clothing and/or other items of personal adornment, I'm always curious about what interests others, and what those others have squirreled away in their closets.

Saul obviously spends a lot of time in Turkey, but I see he has several items from other locales in Asia. Having spent quite a few years in Saudi Arabia, I've been able to lay hands on a few things that one does not often find in the textile markets.

In the southwest of Saudi Arabia, handicrafts take on a level of quality significantly better than those from other areas of the kingdom, probably due to availability of materials, and, food and water.

Here's one such piece, a woman's headpiece that weighs about five pounds due to the large number of soft metal (probably a lead-silver alloy) beads. It's about 20 inches wide and 40 inches long:



Sewn inside the upper edge is a cylinder of heavy wood; the piece is placed over the head so the wooden rod hangs down over the forehead; the rest drapes over the woman's back. This piece probably dates back to the pre-WWII period.

I'll post a few more pieces after I get the images prepped.

Regards,
Chuck Wagner

__________________
Chuck Wagner

Hello again all,

echo...

echo...

sound of crickets in the night...



Here are some more images of ethnographic Saudi traditional handicrafts, starting with more headgear (I'm pretty sure at least one was posted previously, but I can't find it so it must have been in a Show & Tell session). They all have one feature in common: high tolerance for tedious work on the part of the maker. In addition, all are built for use; in detail, the construction is quite robust.

This is a closeup of the piece in the previous post, which has some minor chain stitch embroidery work at the lower edge, and a feature sometimes found in Baluchi work: an extra fringe installed before the end of the piece. This piece is typical of the region alnog either side of the Asir mountains along the southeastern Red Sea.




The next two pieces are types also found in the Asir, but this style extends up into the Hijaz region as well. This piece has a beaded headstrap rather than a wood rod for head placement:



Here's a closer look at the beadwork; there is a stitch between each bead securing the bead yarn to the groundwork of the headdress:



And here's a closeup of the beaded fringe at the bottom; also another example of the tedious part. How does one go about creating a grid of beaded threads ??:



The last piece is for a child; roughly 10 inches across, with a small wood rod at the top that holds the piece after being draped ove the forehead. This is the newest of the three pieces, probably no more than about 40 years old:






This is a handmade dress (the design is typical of the Bani Malik tribe, of the Asir) - lots of embroidery and faux metallic yarn:




Unlike the plain black veils often found in populated areas, the Bedouin women of the mountain west, north & central Hijaz, and (in the old days) along the Persian Gulf wear colorful masks as veils. This one is typical of the western mountains and the Red Sea coast. The coins are from the 1930's and the mother-of-pearl buttons are hand carved out of shell material; there is no reason to suspect that this particular piece is any newer than that:



This piece is more typical of the Hijaz region, and is newer, probably 1940's-1950's:



As long as no one is griping, I'll toss in a couple other personal items that aren't really clothing.

It is quite common in this region for the women to apply Khol, a black powder made of ground galena (lead sulfide) as eye makeup - a familar sight - dark eyeliner. This is a leather & cowrie kohl bottle holder; there is a glass bottle in the middle that has had wet leather shrunk around it for a secure ride:



And, last, a handmade & decorated coffee bean bag from the bedouin tribes of the northern Rub Al Khali, probably the Murrah, entirely of leather:



Clearly, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I see it wherever people of limited means take the time to create intricate work with an eye for design that is pleasing for themselves; these pieces fit that category.

Regards,
Chuck Wagner

__________________
Chuck Wagner

Chuck -

The point is made frequently that we buy various textiles not only because they can sometimes be quite beautiful but also because of their ethnographic character. They let us "participate" in a limited way in the cultures of their makers.

I personally find your items very interesting and the dress especially attractive.

I don't own any, but have seen some Palestinian textiles that seem to me also to be very interesting and sometimes beautiful.

Here is just one link to a site that displays some of the latter:

http://www.thisweekinpalestine.com/details.php?id=1989&ed=134&edid=134

I fear that I do not know even the books on Palestinian textiles that would be recommended.

Regards,

R. John Howe

Hi Chuck,

Definitely no griping from me. I think those pieces are very interesting, and some are very attractive in their own way.

Here are a few pieces from further east. The first is a baby carrier, probably from the Miao tribal group in S. China. I am not sure of the function or source of the others, but they certainly seem like functional clothing items. Both have very long straps attached, presumably to tightly attach them to the person wearing them. The second item has a number of metal objects (bells, etc.) and shells. Interestingly, I find the general aesthetics of these to be rather similar to some of the clothing from central Asia and further west as illustrated in your most recent post. The fineness of the work in some of these Chinese tribal textiles is often very impressive.

James.

Marty, your Balenciaga jacket was a lovely gift to your godmother. Off the top of my head -- and not fact-checking on Google -- Cristobal Balenciaga was the greatest Spanish couturier of the 20th century. I think he was known for his use of color and for the unusual cut of his clothing.
Steve, thanks for the exhibition photos. I especially liked the braid cover with the hammer and sickle, but maybe that is a reflection of my appreciation of war rugs. As someone who has designed and installed any number of exhibitions of artworks in a range of media, however, I have to say that oak panelling (while beautiful in itself) does not show the objects off to any advantage. White walls have become something of a modernist cliche, but they do the job when you want to focus on the objects and not the context.

G'day all,

James, your pieces are wonderful - I especially liked the apron/baggish looking one on the right and below. The workmanship of these surely does show they were made with passion and care, let alone their art appeal.

That you are able to get around in such interesting surroundings, enabling you to come across such artifacts is a boon of living in Asia - Canada may not offer the same prospects, with the exception of native American wonders.

Janet, thanks, yes Doreen was quite overwhelmed with the jacket - she knew little of the maker either but at least had heard the name as being something out of the ordinary. This was prior to Google, and once I no longer had it there didnt seem much point in trying to investigate. It was a goody, though.

Another interesting thing I found recently was an embroidered cartridge belt which appears to be from eastern Europe. Not very old because it has what looks like machine pressed metal buckle holes set in the leather. The embroidery is on a panel attached to the leather. Small calibre.

Regards,
Marty.

Wow, Miao

James,

At a Seattle Textile and Rug Society meeting we recently had the pleasure of a presentation by someone who must be considered a foremost authority on Miao costume, Dr. Tomoko Torimaru.

Here is a link to the announcement:

http://www.seattletextileandrugsociety.org/PDFs/TomokoTorimaru.pdf

The sheer variety of techniques, designs, materials and methods used by the traditional Miao culture in their clothing and functional items is overwhelming.
I learned one thing that I was unaware of previously. They use "flat cocoon" silk in some of their pieces. They place the silk worms on a flat surface so they cannot weave the typical long, round cocoon. Instead, the silk is laid flat, making a "sheet" of silk.
The Miao live in a land-locked region of southern China, having migrated there from farther north to evade invading armies. They make their own indigo and other dyes, their own cloth from cotton and silk, and their embroidery is unbelievably fine. The winters are cold and since they are mostly rice farmers, this gives them a few months to create their spectacular clothing and other items such as shoes, hats, aprons, baby carriers (often with butterflies because their creation myth says their "father" was a sweet-gum tree and their "mother" was a butterfly) scarves, belts and more.
Dr. Torimaru is writing a book about these pieces.


Patrick Weiler

Hi James,

Of the group, my favorite is the third piece; I like the colors and the balance. I've always been interested in calendered indigo cloth, so the second piece is my next favorite. I finally found a strip of that stuff, from Niger (Tuareg country) - really attractive, but just like in the pictures, you'll be blue by the time you're done handling it.

We've not got much from southeast Asia; Miao work has been on our list of "things to do" for a while, but also on the "things to do - not done yet" list. Nice pieces, congratulations!

Regards,
Chuck Wagner

__________________
Chuck Wagner

Thanks Chuck.

We have a number more pieces, some of them just panels from old clothing items. When I get back home perhaps I'll post a few diverse examples to whet your appetite further.

I do think these are interesting and worthy objects for textile enthusiasts. All of my purchases have been from flea and antique markets in China. I have found that if you don't mind a bit of bargaining the prices are VERY reasonable compared to many other textiles.

James.

Dear folks -

The Textile Museum's annual symposium is happening this weekend. The theme, this year, is collecting.

Several of the speakers will treat clothing and costume.

http://www.textilemuseum.org/symposium.htm

I may have more to report after today's lectures.

Regards,

R. John Howe

Interested in purchasing some textiles

quote:

---

Originally posted by Steve Price
Hi James

The pieces we passed up always get better in memory. It reminds me of an incident at one of the ACOR dealer fairs some years back. I found a beautiful, mint Yomud uuk-bash, and put it down long enough to haggle the price with the dealer. While I was doing that, another collector picked it up, read the price tag, and bought it.

I ran into him later, and he apologized for taking it out from under my nose, but hoped I'd understand. I told him that I actually got the better of it. He now owned it, and would find every flaw in it sooner or later. I, on the other hand, had only my memory, and it would get better every year in my mind. Interestingly, he contacted me a year or two later and wanted to sell it to me at a substantial profit. I declined.

Regards

Steve Price

---

Hi Chuck,

I would love to purchase a few of your items if you are willing to give them up.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Chuck Wagner
Hello again all,

echo...

echo...

sound of crickets in the night...



Here are some more images of ethnographic Saudi traditional handicrafts, starting with more headgear (I'm pretty sure at least one was posted previously, but I can't find it so it must have been in a Show & Tell session). They all have one feature in common: high tolerance for tedious work on the part of the maker. In addition, all are built for use; in detail, the construction is quite robust.

This is a closeup of the piece in the previous post, which has some minor chain stitch embroidery work at the lower edge, and a feature sometimes found in Baluchi work: an extra fringe installed before the end of the piece. This piece is typical of the region alnog either side of the Asir mountains along the southeastern Red Sea.




The next two pieces are types also found in the Asir, but this style extends up into the Hijaz region as well. This piece has a beaded headstrap rather than a wood rod for head placement:



Here's a closer look at the beadwork; there is a stitch between each bead securing the bead yarn to the groundwork of the headdress:



And here's a closeup of the beaded fringe at the bottom; also another example of the tedious part. How does one go about creating a grid of beaded threads ??:



The last piece is for a child; roughly 10 inches across, with a small wood rod at the top that holds the piece after being draped ove the forehead. This is the newest of the three pieces, probably no more than about 40 years old:






This is a handmade dress (the design is typical of the Bani Malik tribe, of the Asir) - lots of embroidery and faux metallic yarn:




Unlike the plain black veils often found in populated areas, the Bedouin women of the mountain west, north & central Hijaz, and (in the old days) along the Persian Gulf wear colorful masks as veils. This one is typical of the western mountains and the Red Sea coast. The coins are from the 1930's and the mother-of-pearl buttons are hand carved out of shell material; there is no reason to suspect that this particular piece is any newer than that:



This piece is more typical of the Hijaz region, and is newer, probably 1940's-1950's:



As long as no one is griping, I'll toss in a couple other personal items that aren't really clothing.

It is quite common in this region for the women to apply Khol, a black powder made of ground galena (lead sulfide) as eye makeup - a familar sight - dark eyeliner. This is a leather & cowrie kohl bottle holder; there is a glass bottle in the middle that has had wet leather shrunk around it for a secure ride:



And, last, a handmade & decorated coffee bean bag from the bedouin tribes of the northern Rub Al Khali, probably the Murrah, entirely of leather:



Clearly, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I see it wherever people of limited means take the time to create intricate work with an eye for design that is pleasing for themselves; these pieces fit that category.

Regards,
Chuck Wagner

---

Hi Taj

Welcome to Turkotek.

The smilies in your post make me think that you're only joking about buying those pieces, but just in case you're serious: we don't permit soliciting purchases or sales on Turkotek.

Thanks, and regards.

Steve Price

Hi Steve,

I apologize for that. I didn't know that items posted here weren't for sale by the posters. I also didn't put a smilie there to make a joke. I was serious in what I posted.

I made a mistake I guess. Thank you for informing me of my faults and mistakes.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Steve Price
Hi Taj

Welcome to Turkotek.

The smilies in your post make me think that you're only joking about buying those pieces, but just in case you're serious: we don't permit soliciting purchases or sales on Turkotek.

Thanks, and regards.

Steve Price

---

Hi Taj

No problem, and I hope this won't keep you away.

There are a number of reasons why we don't permit the site to be used as a venue for promotions or commerce. The most important one is that we believe that promotions often give someone an incentive for not being candid.

Regards

Steve Price