Subject | : | Modern dyes |
Author | : | Marvin Amstey mailto:%20mamstey1@rochester.rr.com |
Date | : | 12-09-2001 on 02:26 p.m. |
Dear Michael, Excellent essay; great analogy! Just a short note about a personal experience: as a collector, it is difficult to chose a rug for a high traffic area, so we chose a new "Aubusson" with dyes claimed by the seller to be artificial chrome dyes. One would have thought that they would be stable forever and not change - at least not like a collectable rug. Wrong! They faded like badly applied natural dyes, only in this case they - mostly the indigoid - faded to nearly nothing in less than 3 years. This is consistent with your hypothesis: poor quality will lead to no buyers, unless they are "winos" looking for the quick, cheap thrill. Regards, Marvin |
Subject | : | Re:Modern dyes |
Author | : | Patrick Weiler mailto:%20theweilers@attbi.com |
Date | : | 12-10-2001 on 09:44 a.m. |
Marvin,
I am also trying your experiment. Michael presented many things about wine I was unaware of. The most
startling is that I have probably never drunk a really good wine. It would
cost way more than I would expect to pay. Similarly, I will probably not
buy a REALLY good modern rug. Because my reason for buying a modern rug is
to get a cheaper floor covering rather than a work of art for the wall.
And if I am buying a work of art for the wall, I will try to buy an
antique rug, because I know that it has already mellowed to become a
beautiful rug - I do not have to wait for 75 years to enjoy it at its
peak. Someone else did that for me. |
Subject | : | Re:Modern dyes |
Author | : | Steve Price mailto:%20sprice@hsc.vcu.edu |
Date | : | 12-10-2001 on 10:00 a.m. |
Hi Patrick,
I'm not sure, but I suspect that Michael doesn't think there is a mass market for excellent new rugs that are very expensive, just as there isn't a mass market for excellent wines that are very expensive. My interpretation of his thesis is that right now the mass market is uninformed about the difference between excellent new rugs and carpetoids (just as they were uninformed about the difference between excellent wines and lousy ones until the German government stepped in and began regulating label information). Now they can buy lousy wines with labels that don't confuse them, and Michael would like the same to be true for rugs. I see considerable merit in the idea, although there's a lot of room within which the Law of Unintended Consequences can operate, especially in the USA. Regards, Steve Price |
Subject | : | Re:Modern dyes |
Author | : | Michael mailto:%20koek@dv-kombinat.de |
Date | : | 12-10-2001 on 12:47 p.m. |
Hi everybody, thanks to Steve for correctly interpreting my intentions ! Patrick, from distant Europe I do not see how experienced You are as a collector. Any antique rugs' success depends on the right harmony obtained by saturated colours which are never mellowed when the weave is done. A rug that has merits from being mellowed is something questionable, I guess. I admit that the number of really early pieces which are not mellowed is small - but I insist that they build up the measures. At least as long as we talk of textile art. For home textiles everybody might do what he wants. The damaged (mellowed) piece of art will always rank below the intact one. The early mellowed fragments of kilims we appreciate because we did not find better ones (yet ?). - Here, in Germany, a normal wine costs about 2,3 $ a bottle, whereas a real good wine can be found from 4,1 $ upwards. If You find no difference between them go with the price. Marvin, I find Your contribution interesting. The coloristic impact of
Indigo cannot be obtained with the different forms of chromium dyes. A
collectable rug should not have dyes that fade within only 3 years
! Michael Bischof |
Subject | : | Re:Modern dyes |
Author | : | Marvin Amstey mailto:%20mamstey1@rochester.rr.com |
Date | : | 12-10-2001 on 04:36 p.m. |
Hi Michael, I appreciate your comments and agree with them. Here is another modern dye and recent rug production story that contradicts your best quality:highest price relationship. I have seen three rugs recently with a local dealer that are modern Iranian weaves. Very fine weaves - picture motifs - with the most garish unnatural colors that I have ever seen. The price of these "masterpieces" is around US$750. per sq ft. I'm told that one is buying a design from a known "master" (at least known somewhere) who uses a lot of wool per sq inch (no silk in these). Best regards, Marvin |